Landships II

Paul · Sergeant

Help wanted: Photo Identification

mad zeppelin · Commander in Chief

The cap is an officer's cap. Many people bought one and wore it when on leave. The uniform is normal issue for privates, the colour isn't unusual - it's just clean and the light is good.
The people in the uppermost photograph are on basic training and wearing the old blue uniforms. Note that ErsBtl IR 26 is a basic training units. These very often trained men that would go to other units than those one expects (normal would be IR 26 and RIR 26, but these basic training units usually had up to 25 clients).
1. Komp F.R.D. should indicate a company in a regiment. F usually stands for F�silier, R for Regiment, D for ?. Shouldn't be division, because companies were numbered 1 to 12 (later 13) in a regiment. 1. Komp of a division makes no sense.
The other possible explanation is cavalry (because of the light colour cap bands) then the meaning could be F ? Reserve-Dragoner.

mad zeppelin · Commander in Chief

Stupid me: F.R.D. = Feld-Rekruten-Depot.
Just another training institution. Having completed initial basic training at the ErsBtl (which was stationed at the peace time garrison of the parent regiment), soldiers were sent on to FRDs (controlled by the divisions to which the parent regiments belonged) for further basic training, this time the instructors being combat experienced officers and NCOs from that division.

Paul · Sergeant

Hallo Mad Zeppelin
thanx for your postings.

"Feld-Rekruten-Depot" seems to be the right answer to me.

If I get you right, you said, that on the "IR26" - picture a training unit has been mugged. And because of the less people shown (only 11 instead of usually 25) you think it is an ErsBtl. So could it be, that my Great-Grandfather was from the beginnig of the war only a Landwehrmann? Maybe he had never been a "normal" soldier because of his age. I remember my mother said, he was near 25, when the war started. (I will ask her about that.)
On�http://www.deutsche-kriegsgeschichte.de/wehrpfl.html I have found info's bout the military draft in this time. It says: "With age of 20 years everyone had to serve for 7 years. After 2 years the soldier was on the reserve list. After that the draftee go to the Landwehr. First in the I. array for years, second in the II. array 'till he's 39. 'Till the person is 45, he had to serve in the Landsturm."
But in the order of battle from 1914 (wich is descriped very detailed on http://www.tulipacademy.org/gew/ddhob/) there is no Landwehrregiment carrying this number. Only seperates of them. Has every Rgt. his own Landwehr-part?

To the colors of the bands: Dragoons carry a red band, as shown on the plate here on Landships:
http://www.landships.freeservers.com/jpegs/german_unif_DF_plate1.JPG
Only Ulans may possible, they wear yellow.(But Thomas�Trauner wrote me, that the istructions often�where lax handled. So maybe the colour often differs, like we�can see on different shades of Feldgrau.)But�is it still imaginable that in FRD many branches of service where trained?

To the cap: it is also only a question of fashion, that my Great-Grandfather wear this cap? Never heard that soldiers can by an officer's cap only to look stylish. Very interesting.And one more question: the officer in the background, left beside the man with the E.K.2, what kind of band goes round his cap? What rank do the both officers have?

...questions 'bout questions...

PS: You're so right, MZ, these are really blue uniforms. But is'nt it very unusual in 1916? Or maybe it belongs to the Landwehrstatus?

-- Edited by Paul at 15:07, 2007-06-04

mad zeppelin · Commander in Chief

On mobilisation in 1914 - the peace time IR 26 at Magdeburg would raise the following formations:
- IR 26 (field-regiment), a unit of 7th ID
- RIR 26, a unit of 6th RD
- LdwIR 26, a unit of 13. gemischte LdwBrigade
- ErsBtl 26 (remaining at Magdeburg).
What you see in the first photo is a Korporalschaft of ErsBtl 26 on basic training at Magdeburg. The use of old blue uniforms with the Ersatz formations had specially been ordered because there were sufficient stocks and the field grey stuff was needed for the field troops.
Reservists could be used with field and reserve units. Landwehr I (the first 5 years) could go to reserve and Landwehr units. Landwehr II and Landsturm would go to Landsturm formations.
DragonerRgts 9, 10, 24 and 25 had white bands. But FDRs were mixed formations anyway.

The officer's cap is a matter of fashion. The authorities didn't really like it, but there were also no strong measures against it.

Paul · Sergeant

Thanx a lot, MZ!

These facts are all new to me. Where did you get this informations. Maybe you got a good surf- or literature advice for me.

One conclusion of your kindly information is, that the plate in the landships mainside, wich show the German bands, batches etc., is'nt complete. I always thought so.

That it is the ErsBtl 26 did you conclude of the fact, that the uniforms are blue, right?
What branch of service was in a FRD depends from the division, or a superior formation? Maybe this explains the fieldpostcard with the chop of "211. Inf.Div.", in case my Great-Grandfather was wounded while his activities�'round this time, that foto was shot.

kind regards, MZ!

mad zeppelin · Commander in Chief

The LdwIR 26 is listed as formation belonging to 211th ID at one time during the war, but I've no TOE showing date and composition of the infantry brigade.
The 211st was formed in September 1916 and dissolved in August 1918. It served in the west (Somme 1916, Chemin des Dames 1917, St.Quentin and Chemin des Dames in 1918). I've a TOE of the 211st from 1916 and one from spring 1918, in both the LdwIR 26 does not show. And in 1917, the LdwIR 26 is listed as belonging to 23. LdwDiv.

Paul · Sergeant

Thanx again. Can ask� you second time where do you get your information from? Maybe I can buy this book or search this webside. All German sides only show the battle of order in 1914.

And what means TOE?

PS: Have found an evidence for the Landwehr-Regiment Nr. 26 being involved in fightings while the battle of Argonne Wood�on 14.09.1914. "Des Weiteren wurden durch einzelne Kompanien des Landwehr Infanterie Regiment 26 Vienne Le Chateau, Le Four de Paris, Barricade-Pavillon sowie Varennes gesichert. Somit bestand ergo kurzzeitig eine Doppelverbindung zwischen den Armeen. Durch Wechsel der Befehle wurden die Teile des Landwehr Infanterie Regiments 26 jedoch baldigst abgezogen und marschierte Richtung Varennes zum XIII. Armeekorps." (http://www.verdun14-18.de/pages/ge/Argonnenschlacht.htm). (also in English and French)

-- Edited by Paul at 10:03, 2007-06-05