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Landships II -> Landships WW1 Forum -> Softskin vehicles -> 1901 French Steam Wagon, possibly.
Post Info TOPIC: 1901 French Steam Wagon, possibly.
James H


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1901 French Steam Wagon, possibly.
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A bit off-topic, but this seems to be French from 1901. Is it within anyone's field of interests?

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d_fernetti


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Very interesting (since I saw that Keilkraft kit of the steam machine I'm sort of hooked) Is there any chance that we can get drawings of this monster? More pictures? A kit?

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James H


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I've now done what I should have done in the first place, which is to consult the Oracle, Ellis & Bishop. Obvious, really. There's a huge write-up on this vehicle (Plate No. 7) and it's a very interesting machine.

It's a Tracteur Scotte, designed by a hat-maker and trialled with the French Army in 1898 by the Commission Militaire des Automobiles after they saw it at a trial conducted by the Automobile Club de France. It pulled guns of more than 25 tons and loads equivalent to the weight of a complete battery transport. The Commission thought it had great potential and recommended the purchase of six examples. The War Ministry objected on the grounds of expense and the apparently dubious claim of shortage of suitable roads.

Eventually two were purchased in 1900. The caption says Manoeuvres in the East, 1901, so this must be one of those two. A rare photo of a very promising machine. It's certainly got very clean lines and a pleasingly compact look.

27 horsepower, range without refuelling 50 kilometres. No details of how long it remained in service.

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d_fernetti


Hero

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Fascinating! And I would bet that no hat-maker from the XXIth century can design a thing like that!
Alas, it must be a pain to wear on the head.

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James H


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d_fernetti wrote:

Very interesting (since I saw that Keilkraft kit of the steam machine I'm sort of hooked) Is there any chance that we can get drawings of this monster? More pictures? A kit?


Can't find any drawings, but here's a pic of what must be his first (1892) attempt, which took part in a race from Paris to Rouen in '94. His subsequent improvements led to the 1897 model.

This link has a bit more info on the latter:
http://cnum.cnam.fr/CGI/fpage.cgi?8XAE582.1/518/100/543/0014/0521





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d_fernetti


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A remarkably unmilitary vehicle!

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Ironsides


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Hi, an interesting machine..looks like it has wooden wheels with iron rims...

Cheers

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EDUARDO MAMORETTI


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Ironsides wrote:



Hi, an interesting machine..looks like it has wooden wheels with iron rims...

Cheers


Cheers, gentlemen,
Agree with You all. What a nice vehicule!
And indeed the wheeis seem to be wooden , so they  would need   at least  external metalic rings,as well as any cart and many "trucks"from the era.
I  even would assume most of the structure must be wooden pannels.

Further info would be very welcome!
All the best, Eduardosmile



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James H


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EDUARDO MAMORETTI wrote:

Ironsides wrote:



Hi, an interesting machine..looks like it has wooden wheels with iron rims...

Cheers


Cheers, gentlemen,
Agree with You all. What a nice vehicule!
And indeed the wheeis seem to be wooden , so they  would need   at least  external metalic rings,as well as any cart and many "trucks"from the era.
I  even would assume most of the structure must be wooden pannels.

Further info would be very welcome!
All the best, Eduardosmile


Just read the accompanying text properly, and, yes, the wheels were wood with metal rims. The technical data differ a little from Ellis & Bishop, but not much. Interesting that it had no fewer than three braking systems. The French is somewhat archaic, but it seems to have been able to refuel itself with water in  transit by means of a "steam ejector" carried by the tractor. I assume that means its own steam-powered pump. It also, of course, had to fill up with coal!

-- Edited by James H at 02:08, 2007-09-30

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Runflat


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Another picture of a Scotte appears in 'Les Camions de la Victoire - Le Service automobile pendant la Grande Guerre (1914 - 1918)' by Jean-Michel Boniface and Jean-Gabriel Jeudy.

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ergie


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More information & ilustrations:

La Nature No.1389 (6.01.1900)
http://cnum.cnam.fr/GIFS/4KY28.54/0099.T.95.966.1417.gif
http://cnum.cnam.fr/GIFS/4KY28.54/0100.T.96.966.1417.gif
http://cnum.cnam.fr/GIFS/4KY28.54/0101.T.97.966.1417.gif

La Nature No.1439 (22.12.1901)
http://cnum.cnam.fr/GIFS/4KY28.56/0055.T.51.966.1417.gif
http://cnum.cnam.fr/GIFS/4KY28.56/0056.T.52.966.1417.gif

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Ironsides


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James H wrote:

A bit off-topic, but this seems to be French from 1901. Is it within anyone's field of interests?

 

Hi James Im fairly certain this is a "Serpollet" steam car you can read a fair bit about it in "mechanical traction in War" page 31 to download the book click on "all files HTTP" and then "mechanicaltract01layrgoog.pdf"...

 

Cheerswink



-- Edited by Ironsides on Monday 23rd of January 2012 01:04:31 AM

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Tankcommander


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The "Scotte" 1895 (Civilian version)

DJ

Train Scotte.jpg

 



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Ironsides


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Hi Tank Commander thanks for posting the pic most interesting,  the caption is wrong I think in one regard and that is that Maurice Audibert (an independent producer based in Lyon) ended his dealings with Scotte in 1895 with an agreement to the effect that he would not produce steam vehicles he then formed a gas automobile company with a friend Émile Lavirotte...

So it follows that he could not have built the Tractor for the Military Train Scotte, I believe this was built by Buffaud & Robatel... typically its a very complex story that involves a number of major players but more on that later...

 

Cheerswink

 



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Ironsides


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Scotte Patents, Boiler and Wagon drawings
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Heres some Patents for the Scotte circa 1895 the GB patent has some usefull scale drawings not the military version but close enough I think..

Cheerswink



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Ironsides


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Scotte Paris-Rouen 1894
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Italian wiki has a fairly extensive article on the race including this pic of the Scotte, I suspect that the passengers are Maurice Audibert (right front) and Joanny Scotte(middle front) but cant be certain...

http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parigi-Rouen_1894

Cheerswink



 



-- Edited by Ironsides on Sunday 29th of January 2012 12:54:24 PM

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Ironsides


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RE: 1901 French Steam Wagon, possibly.
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Serpollet Patents

Cheerssmile



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Serpollet CH1038A.pdf (1,161.6 kb)
CH7958A.pdf (227.1 kb)
CH17913A[1].pdf (248.9 kb)
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Ernst Plattner

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A contemporary cardbord model of the Train-Scotte was edited under the false name "Train Scott" ,No.1090 "locomotive" and 1090bis "camion", by the Imagerie d'Epinal, Pellerin & Co in 1910. A picture of a built-up model can be supplied.

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