Landships II

Ivan · Field Marshal

Captured Ehrhardt-BAK. Russia

K-Flak · Lieutenant

Very rare kind of picture. Are you sure about 1916? The gun looks like a M.1914 model and is still carrying the protective shield which was removed soon after beginning of WWI from the K-Flak (still called BAK in this time). Maybe the date of publication /photo in Russian service (?) is 1916?

Did you compare this picture with other Russian pictures of the lost German K-Flak from 1914 (Lt. Adami)?

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-- Edited by K-Flak on Monday 12th of September 2011 11:18:11 AM

Ivan · Field Marshal

K-Flak wrote:
Very rare kind of picture. Are you sure about 1916? The gun looks like a M.1914 model and is still carrying the protective shield which was removed soon after beginning of WWI from the K-Flak (still called BAK in this time). Maybe the date of publication /photo in Russian service (?) is 1916?
Did you compare this picture with other Russian pictures of the lost German K-Flak from 1914 (Lt. Adami)?
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-- Edited by K-Flak on Monday 12th of September 2011 11:18:11 AM

�The picture was published in a Russian journal from mai 1916, without comment. Uniform of the Russians is clear from the time of WWI. All I know. I am surprised also that there is an old Ehrhardt.

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Before the war the Russians wanted to buy these�BAKs in Germany, but not get a single. Since 1914, they built themselves BAKs on Russo-Baltique (4 piece of armor, 4 withoud armor), and american White chassis. Project of Lender & Tarnowsky, Poutiloff-work.

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It is known that the Russians have captured a minimum 7 BAKs and 2 of them have repaired�in Petrograd at Poutiloff-work and put in service.

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Besides these, I still have several�good pictures of a Daimler with Rheinmetall (!!!) gun, incidentally, also with the shield. This was captured in 1915 of 246 infantry regiment of RIA�in Kopziewo (Russian Poland). He has German number plate IC 2277. Unfortunately I can not show the photos public.

About K-Flak from Lt. Adamy I know nothing.
If you show me the pictures discreet, I show my pictures of 1915.

My email is: kiriletz*t-online.de (* = @)

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K-Flak · Lieutenant

About Adami�s Kraftwagengesch�tz:

I have to correct me concerning Adami. He was Oberleutnant (not Leutnant) and Eastprussian therefore surely especially motivated for the fights in the East. He took part in ground combat (like several times before) to support infantry on 28 September 1914 near Kopziowo [spelling in source but means Kopziewo] in a very exposed way.

So, I wonder if your pictures are in fact pictures not of 1915 but of Oberleutnant Adami�s Kraftwagengesch�tz captured in 1914 near Kopziewo. Btw his gun was the only German K-BAK (of a total of 6 at the beginning of the war, 5 in the west) on the Eastern front in 1914.�

The enemy was very close [allegedly a Kosakenpatrouille (?)], took the car under fire. Adami and the driver were fatally hit and the gun rammed into a muddy trench near the street. It was not possible to recover the Flak because of the general retreat. One source claims the BAK was destroyed and only pieces fell into enemies hands but this is surely a propagandistic claim made in this source of 1943.�

I have seen the afore mentioned pictures on a Russian website and downloaded them. However, I think it will last some time to search my 100s of Gigabytes today in the evening. So, be a bit patient. Maybe they are your pictures thought to be 1915. As well 246 infantry regiment rings a bell to me. Furthermore, I will check if I have information concerning the type of K-Flak used by Adami and his crew and e-mai you.�

Find your information about the known number of captured BAK very interesting. Is there more known about the specific types captured?

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Ivan · Field Marshal

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I think we are talking about the same.

My photos from K-flak from Kopziewo are RGVIA (Russian State Military Archive). Which are dated 1915, but are in the archive data, there are many errors. It is possible that the images are from the 1914th A total of�six images (three of which I have in good quality and�others three�in small format), all show as K-Flak in intact without damage. He stands next to wood house in the village guarded by Russian infantrymen. Cossack is not seen, and are infantrymen of 246 infantry regiment of the RIA. It is also written in the archive. I guess they have loaded the same pictures from the Internet (Hmepage of my friend Michail Blinoff?), only in a small format.
Several colleagues have identified the picture: Daimler chassis with Rheinmetall gun (very rare combination). Even a picture of the vehicle was shown in Russian magazine, but there is written: Krupp gun (att). The magazin is of 1915!!!

About two captured K-Flaks is it data in the archive of Pouliloff factory (now Kirowski plant), which were repaired there. And the total number of 7 captured K-Flaks (possible some of Austrians) I found a document from the Russian Ministry of War of July 1917. No more pictures.

P.S. I still have good pictures of Daimler-Krupp "Max" and "Moritz", the Baltic Freikorps of Bermondt-Awalow let 1919th in Riga. The Latvians have put into service.

Sorry for bad english confuse

-- Edited by Ivan on Tuesday 13th of September 2011 02:16:39 PM

K-Flak · Lieutenant

Indeed, the pictures were very little and displayed the BAK ahead of fence and farmhouse.

As well Adami�s BAK� was reportedly Rheinische Metallwaarenfabrik, type of car not mentioned in my sources. However, the Ehrhardt lorries were not so good as Daimler (according to German military reports) and the combination Rheinmetall gun put on Daimler car possible but extremly rare.� I e-mail to you on the direct way.