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Landships II -> Landships WW1 Forum -> Tanks -> Baby Holt Track Plates
Post Info TOPIC: Baby Holt Track Plates
James H


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Baby Holt Track Plates
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Does anyone know what the track plates on a Baby Holt looked like? I can't find a photo that's clear enough. The plates on the Schneider CA are very different from those on the 75hp Holt. Does that mean that the Baby was different from the 75 or that Schneider designed new plates when the running gear was modified?



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Roger Todd


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Attached is the only reasonably clear photo I've seen of a Baby Holt (it is labelled as such in the book I scanned it from, but owing to the positioning of my scanner it cuts off the side of the page and caption). It's a bit of a crap scan as I never could get my good scanner working again and have had to resort to the scanner in my new combined printer-scanner unit...



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James H


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Thank you, Roger. That is most helpful. They seem to be identical to those on the 75.

But something remarkable has happened in the interim. I have found a photo of the Baby in an issue of Tank Zone, and it matches Roger's pic. There is also a photo and a drawing of the Schneider prototype - and it has the same tracks as the Baby. But by the time we get to the production Schneider the track has changed completely and looks very like the track on the Renault FT.

I'll do some scans later so you can se what I mean. AFAIK Renault were careful to patent their designs. Does this mean some arrangement was arrived at between Renault and Schneider?



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James H


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Photos enclosed.

Top left: Baby

Bottom left: Schneider prototype

Top right: Early production Schneider

Bottom right: FT

The Saint-Chamond's tracks appear to be copies of the Holt. The Renault Porteur's also seem to be, but that vehicle was ordered by Gen. Mourret, who naturally insisted on the use of the eight-bogie arrangement. There are photos of the Porteur and the FT side-by-side at the Renault factory with completely different plates. So where did the Schneider plates originate?



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Roger Todd


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Just to confuse things, the Schneider prototype track in the bottom left reminds me of a Holt track I found while searching for Baby Holts earlier. Look at the Schneider prototype track and the track plate just curving upwards on the left appears to have a sort of chevron attached to it, which the Baby Holt I scanned in earlier does not, and neither does the Holt tractor pictured above it. However, look at the track plates on this (non-Baby) Holt tractor (preserved Holt in Abidjan) which also have chevrons, which appear to be separate fittings bolted onto each plate.

Having said all that, the Abidjan Holt's track plates appear to be basically identical to those of the Holt in the top-left of your photo except with the addition of the chevrons which, as I've said, appear to be simply applied additions. The chevrons were presumably optional extras, I assume for more grip.

No idea how significant that is, probably very little if at all.



-- Edited by Roger Todd on Thursday 3rd of November 2011 12:55:30 AM

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James H


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If memory serves, the original Saint-Chamond tracks did not have the chevrons you describe. I think they were introduced on later models in an attempt to improve the tank's grip. It seems that they were not present on the 75 and 120 Holt but were on the Baby. I think that's right, but I'll check.

Maybe one of our French experts will spot this and throw some light on the change of track on the Schneider.



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