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Post Info TOPIC: Saint-Chamond Anti-grenade Improv?


Legend

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Saint-Chamond Anti-grenade Improv?
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Can't scan it just at the mo, but have found a photo of an early Saint-Chamond with what looks like a sapling or young tree laid lengthways on top, one end resting on the central cupola and the other, presumably, on something to keep it horizontal. Some smaller bits of tree are propped against it, sloping to the sides of the vehicle, creating a pitched effect. There's no sign of any netting or suchlike, but I wonder if this was a bit of improv on the part of the crew.

A picture is worth a thousand words, I know.



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Colonel

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The 'other' thing this [silver birch?] trunk could be resting on is the large raised roof panel behind the exhaust - some sort of air intake? Not hugely familiar with the technicalities of the SC, just the appearance.

As you say it is hard to see what this woodwork would achieve on it's own. Even with net or wire secured to it those side angle logs seem to be well in from the edge of the roof potentially leaving large flat areas along either side of the roof where a grenade would quite happily sit.

Pure speculation of course BUT I wonder if they intended to 'thatch' this tank with leafy branches draped over this basic frame, as a crude anti aerial-reconnaisance camouflague ploy? Why not just lob leafy branches on a flat roof? Well, maybe they were intentionally going to leave room underneath the trunk for the exhaust muffler and that raised roof area rather than smother them with foliage. Although I doubt it'd have made a huge amount of difference to the amount or quality of air circulating around that area of the roof and may even have made matters worse by keeping noxious fumes relatively trapped only to be sucked right back into those nearby roof intakes without the chance to disperse well enough.

I repeat, pure guess work... I wonder what we would learn if another photograph of this half-timbered tank emerged?



-- Edited by compound eye on Tuesday 14th of February 2012 05:02:37 PM

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Legend

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This is it. What say you?



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Legend

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This might be an explanation. To the rear is the roof of a ventilator, on which the other end of the tree seems to be resting. It looks as if the purpose is to keep a camouflage net clear of the exhaust, which, I believe, was quite capable of igniting it. It wouldn't have been possible on the versions with the pitched roof and single, square cupola.

There's quite an amusing picture of some early Saint-Chamonds moving along with some of the crew sitting very nonchalantly on the cupolas, and others on fuel drums on the roof, as if they were bar stools.



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Colonel

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Sounds like we're pretty much agreed on the idea of keeping the exhaust & vents clear as well as the idea of aerial camouflage...

Did they actually have proper camouflage nets back then, or would it likely have been improvised local camouflage [such as branches] instead?



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Legend

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IIRC the camouflage net was devised by a Frenchman during WWI. His name now escapes me.



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Field Marshal

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Bonjour James,

This photo from Cyclope was done in Champlieu on 1917, 21 th August.

 This tank from AS 34 was the St Chamond M1 AsP4 n° 62538.

 There is an other Cyclope, in the same Groupe : AS 34 - St Chamond M1 AsCo3 n° 62490.

 If you look at the Epca-D film* taken on Mailly-Poivre (exercice during winter 1918 with St Chamond crossing trenches)

 you can found other tanks with the same kind of trunk.

This trunk was there to roll and open tarpoline from rear to the front of the tank.

The tarpoline was painted in camouflage, and there is only some photos with Schneider and St Chamond under "local camouflage" with branches.

Groupement n° XI (AS 32, AS 34, AS 35) was the only one to test this "system". Their is, for instance, no photo, coming from other Groupes.

 * Look at Ecpa-D DVD with Bruno Jurkiewicz's book on French Tank.

 Très bon après-midi - Michel



-- Edited by Tanker on Thursday 1st of March 2012 01:12:14 PM

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SilverHawkAuthor

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French Schnieder CA1 tank in Canada, Nov 1917
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Bonjour Michel, I look forward to hearing from you and hope you have some information on how this French Schneider CA1 tank came to Canada before the end of the First World War. Harold sends hskaarup@rogers.com

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