Landships II

It most certainly did exist, and, for once, Wikipedia isn't wildly inaccurate. It was a steamroller with a platform fore and aft and an armoured shell around the whole contraption.

The article notes François V's assertion (in Tank Zone) that it was sold to GB and influenced British Tank design. Whilst I find both parts of that statement somewhat implausible, FV gives a source: a "rare and very detailed" 64-page document published in 1919 by an E. Plonquet (which might or might not be Plunkett). FV says that the photos in the Tank Zone article are from this booklet, and that Monsieur Frot notified J-L. Breton in January 1918 that the machine had been sold. Considering that the apparatus was rejected on April 10th, 1915, it all seems very odd. F acknowledges that there is no mention of it in British accounts, but all the other non-starters are mentioned, so I don't really see why such a purchase shouldn't be. Even if it was simply forgotten or rejected, I think that to say it influenced British development is a rather hard one to swallow.

Maybe if François drops by, he could tell us more about Monsieur/Mister Plonquet/Plunkett.

Bonsoir à tous,

Sorry James, no Mister Plunkett on board.

The booklet is signed by a Monsieur E. Plonquet (never heard about him) and was printed in Meaux (East of Paris, where, by the way a beautiful Museum on World War One is open since 11th Nov. 2011) in 1919, by Imprimerie G. Lepillet, place de la Cathédrale.

Exact title of the booklet is : " Rouleau cuirassé, char d'assaut et tank, petit chapitre d'une grande histoire ".

The exact quotation, drawn from the letter written by M. Frot to M. Breton on 8 January 1918, is the following :

" La machine a été vendue aux Anglais. Leur tank, comme forme, se rapproche d'ailleurs si sensiblement du mien, qu'on peut admettre que mon expérience n'a pas été perdue pour tous."

(roughly : " The machine was sold to the English. By the way, the shape of their tank gets so close to mine, that we may admit my trial has not been lost for everybody. ").

Nothing more, nothing less.

But I knew that, in publishing this, I would raise a point. I was not the least surprised when I read it first.

Bien cordialement

François V

(fair enough! We only got François Ier et François II, so far).

Interesting, thank you.

I would, however, take issue with what M. Frot wrote (not you, Francois - none of the following is directed at you):

"The machine was sold to the English. By the way, the shape of their tank gets so close to mine, that we may admit my trial has not been lost for everybody."

The British tanks were so completely different from his machine in every respect that his comment is deluded. The body of his machine sloped up at the front. That is the only resemblance. But there was certainly no sloped all-around track (for the simple reason that his machine wasn't even a tracked vehicle but merely a jumped-up wheeled armoured car*) which was the basic concept (the USP if you like) of the British tanks, as distinct from what the French (and Germans, for that matter) produced. And the first appearance of sloped tracks on any British design were on the model built by Macfie and Nesfield around April 1915, very shortly after Frot's wheeled machine was demonstrated (to, I understand, a select French audience only). There is no indication that they were at all aware of Frot's activities across the Channel, and the path of descent from their work to Wilson, Foster and Mother is well known. The idea that Frot's machine had any influence is simply preposterous. Frot may have believed it, but he was wrong.

*I would even dispute that it should be called a tank at all as it was a wheeled machine. If we start referring to wheeled vehicles as tanks then every armoured car ever made should be so termed.

This is the photo with guns drawn on.