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Landships II -> Landships WW1 Forum -> Tanks -> Pliny E Holt's 1917 tank design
Post Info TOPIC: Pliny E Holt's 1917 tank design
Centurion


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Pliny E Holt's 1917 tank design
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In the US patents files I found a patent applied for in 1917 by Pliny E Holt. Its actualy titled as an armoured tractor but is in fact a tank or assault gun. I enclose an impression of what it might have looked like if built. The patent drawings although sectional have many missing details such as where the exhaust was and where the driver sat. It was clearly not inteded to be just a box on an existing tractor as the engine position (in the middle) rules this out. It would be interesting to know if one of the Holt factories ever built a mock up (or even a real prototype).

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dave1001


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Neat, like a schneider without the front overhang. I wonder how it would have performed...



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Centurion


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I was thinking more akin to the St Chammond - but it does remind me a bit of the later WW2 German assault guns

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Vilkata


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Fantastic! Those patent files are treasure troves. I wonder who "Pliny" was though? I had always assumed that Benjamin Holt did most of the design work on new vehicles. Pliny must certainly have been a relative of his.

Very good job on the image!

---Vil.

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Centurion


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Pliny E was the son I think and Pliny G the grandson - both inventors Judging by the number of patents for tractors, traction engines etc etc plus other sources Pliny did much of Holt's design work from about 1909 or thereabouts but assigned his patents to the company

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Roger Todd


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Pliny E(astman) Holt (1872-1934) was Benjamin Holt's nephew (there was no Pliny G Holt, by the way). The Holt genealogy site tells us:

William H Holt's son, Pliny, was 12 years old on the 1885 Chippewa County census. When his family sold Holt House, he moved to Minneapolis and attended high school, then college at the University of Minnesota. His uncle, Benjamin Holt, had already established the Holt Manufacturing Co. in Stockton, California. After college, Pliny went to work with his uncle in the tractor business in 1896. He received 38 patents on his own and collaborated with other engineers for 60 others. In 1905 he organized and became president of the Aurora Engine Company. In 1909 he established the Holt factory in Peoria, Illinois which later became Caterpillar, Inc.


Excellent as Google Patents is, the Holt patents (Pliny or otherwise) are better downloaded from the UK Patent Office website (they are sharper pdf files). Attached are samples of other Holt patents. The first is a fascinating design by Pliny for detachable powered track units for conventional heavy artillery; the second a more conventional Holt SPG (compare it with the photo of the Mk III SPG).

EDIT: This is getting intolerable! When I edited my post, not only did it pinch Centurion's attachment, but it also deleted mine!!!

-- Edited by Roger Todd at 01:36, 2007-02-17

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Roger Todd


Legend

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Apologies to Centurion - when I re-edited my previous post to add my attachments again, it deleted your attachment from not only my post, but the whole damn thread! This attachments malarkey is p*ssing me off big-time...

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Vilkata


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Excellent information everyone. That first patent drawing is very interesting.

As for the attachment system... I still use the old image upload websites such as Simpload. Theyre a bit archaic, especially considering the forum based system should work but does not. Yet, I just find it overall better to upload my pictures and then link to them through simple bulletin board code. It takes a little extra time, but I never have to worry about this frustrating attachment problem.

---Vil.

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Centurion


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Well somebody called Pliny G Holt certainly submitted patents.

Now I find I can't edit my original post to put the picture back !!!@**

Here it is anyway

Pliny did submit a patent for a large SPG using, I think his detachable track units - I've posted it under softskins

Roger - what is that patent URL ?

-- Edited by Centurion at 11:56, 2007-02-17

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Roger Todd


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Sorry, Pliny G is much later (1960s or so).



-- Edited by Roger Todd at 11:57, 2007-02-17

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Centurion


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I'll have to go back and search -from memory nothing to do with tactors etc and in the 1930s and 40s.

I note that some of Pliny E's patents are listed under E Holt but the name Pliny is on the drawing itself

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Roger Todd


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Centurion, here's the URL:

http://gb.espacenet.com/search97cgi/s97_cgi.exe?Action=FormGen&Template=gb/EN/home.hts

In case it doesn't work, I've shrunk it:

http://tinyurl.com/bjmx2

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Anonymous

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Pliny E Holt was Benjamin's nephew, son of William Holt.  I know a lot about him since his father built my 1884 octagon house in MN.http://www.theholthouse.com/

 

  He went to work for his uncle after studying engineering, did a lot of inventing and obtained 46 patents.  He started a Holt tractor company in Minneapolis which only produced 2 tractors, but stayed with the company for most of his life.



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