Landships II

jagjetta · Brigadier

H.M.A.C. Black Jake

philthydirtyanimal · Commander in Chief

Other than its a Seabrook with the RNAS, and the suspicion that its 'Jake' not 'Joke', I've got nothing!

I thought every one would jump on this thread; such a great picture!

James H · Legend

I thought the name "Black Jake" sounded vaguely piratical. It turns out that there is a character of that name in the children's books of Arthur Ransome (Swallows and Amazons, Peter Duck, etc). He is the villainous captain of the Viper.

Since this was a naval unit confined to dry land, it seemed quite possible that they might have chosen the nickname to give themselves an aura of buccaneering.

Where my argument falls to the ground is that Ransome didn't write his first book in the Swallows and Amazons series until 1929. Then it crossed my mind that maybe the crew just thought it sounded like the sort of name a pirate would have, or that�he might have been a character in an Edwardian children's tale that one of the crew had read.

However, it now appears that there were, surprisingly,�a number of Royal Navy vessels named HMS Black Joke. It seems reasonable to assume that one of these was the inspiration. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Black_Joke

I think this one is favourite: http://www.royalnavalmuseum.org/visi_cfimage_blackjoke.htm

A�fire appliance used by the City of New York in the 1860s also seems to have been named after one or other of the ships. http://www.riotrelieffund.org/?tab=History&page=4

A curious name for a ship. Thought it might be a corruption of a foreign word, but can't find anything on the origins.

jagjetta · Brigadier

Phil W. on the Great War Forum had this to say about the image:

"It is a Seabrook 5 ton chassis. Only about 25-30 were built, the first was delivered on 5th February 1915 by the Portholme Aerodrome Company, of Huntingdon. They were armed with a naval 3-pounder gun and four Vickers-Maxim guns were fitted one on each corner of the rear compartment. The sides folded down to form a gun platform. The armour was 8mm which increased the total weight to 10 tons which confined it to metalled roads or hard surfaces. They were withdrawn towards the end of 1915 and some were sent to Egypt for use against the Senussi."

philthydirtyanimal · Commander in Chief

The 'Tanks!' site says this:

'Using a US 5 ton truck chassis, the Admiralty Air Department of the Royal Navy designed a heavy armored car that was intended to back up the machine gun armed vehicles that had been deployed to Belgium at the start of WW1. The vehicle had more of the appearance of a land based patrol boat than that of an armored car.'

http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/GreatBritain/GB-SeabrookAC.jpg

I hadn't heard that they were used against the Senussi. I doubt they coped very well with the soft going.

They were split off from the other armoured cars because they were so slow.

'Black Jake' does sound more 'piratey'. And 'Black Joke' does seem odd. And my spidey sense was way off (again). Excellent work Holmes!

-- Edited by philthydirtyanimal on Friday 1st of May 2009 10:00:03 PM

-- Edited by philthydirtyanimal on Friday 1st of May 2009 10:03:07 PM

Ironsides · Legend

Seabrook imported "Standard" 5 ton trucks in parts and assembled them at their factory you might find this thread interesting.... nice Pic....

Seabrook Standard

Cheers smile

James H · Legend

I'm not sure about the Egypt bit, either. I thought they were on Home Duties and that it was RRs that were sent to see off the Senussi.

MarkV · Lieutenant-Colonel

Hello,

�

Neal G. and I have come across this naming system in our research into the Rolls Royce armoured cars.

The vehicles of the RNAS squadrons were named after ships in the Royal Navy. In fact, of the 48 Rolls Royce armoured cars in RNAS Squadrons 1-4, we have so far identified 28 named cars - and all but one are named after Royal Navy ships.(The source for the name of the single exception, "Borzoi", has yet to be determined. A Borzoi is apparently a breed of Russian wolf hound, but why this name would be chosen by a Royal Navy armoured car crew is unclear. Was there ever a HMS Borzoi? - Any suggestions for the possible reason for using this name would be appreciated.)

�

Also, all 28 of the RNAS Rolls Royce armoured cars for which we have found names follow the naming convention of:

�

Squadron 1 = names beginning with "A"

Squadron 2 = names beginning with "B"

Squadron 3 = names beginning with "C"

Squadron 4 = names beginning with "D"

�

By this system the Seabrook "Black Joke" would have been assigned to RNAS Squadron 2 when named.� (Each armoured car squadron initially had 12 armoured Rolls Royces and 3 armoured Seabrooks, divided equally into three sections.)

MarkV

-- Edited by MarkV on Saturday 2nd of May 2009 09:41:04 PM

-- Edited by MarkV on Saturday 2nd of May 2009 09:42:34 PM

Rob · Legend

This was posted by me also on the Great War Forum

An interesting anecdote from a Seabrook veteran - they were based in Cromer at one point, with the Seabrooks parked on the front lawn and back garden of the Commander's mother's house! A Zeppelin flew over so low they could see the crew moving about in the gondola cars, a perfect opportunity for the 3 pounders the Seabrook was armed with, but unfortunately they had no shells. Despite the efforts of a motorcycle dispatch rider, they were unable to get hold of any, so, looking very impressive they drove down the high street of Cromer, the locals cheering at the Seabrook crew, thinking they were chasing the Zeppelin to shoot it down!