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Post Info TOPIC: MG Tactics at Amiens 1918
charlieh


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MG Tactics at Amiens 1918
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Hello everyone,

 

The book "The Canadian Emma Gees" by C S Grafton describes how at Amiens, August 1918, tanks were used for the first time to carry MG crews forward in the attack.  It proved a failure as only 4 of 34 guns/crews reached their Blue Line objective.

 

My father was a machine gunner in WW1, 4th Bn CMGC. He told us of surviving just such a ride in a tank that was destroyed in a battle. I have never found in books or records that this scheme was ever used again after Amiens.  If not, then I might be able to conclude that he took part in this attack.

 

I would therefore appreciate any help in determining whether tanks were ever used again to carry MG crews forward in an attack in WW1 after Amiens.

 

 



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James H


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Sorry, Charlieh, only just noticed your enquiry.

I've never come across any mention of this tactic other than with the Mk V* at Amiens. The story goes that the conditions in the Tanks made the MG crews so ill that they were not in a position to contribute anything when they were disgorged, so I suspect the idea was abandoned.

Happy to hear anything to the contrary.

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charlieh


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Hi James,

Thanks for your response.   It seems that since it failed, for several reasons, including 8 on fire and destroyed, some breakdowns, sickness, etc., it was unlikely to be tried again or widely publicized.

Do you happen to know the tank organization used (Canadian Tank Corps, or Brit Tank Corps)? I understand the gun crews were from the 4th Bn CMGC.

Charlie


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James H


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Quoting D. Fletcher:

"Those (Battalions) equipped with Mk V* tanks - the 1st supporting the Canadians in the south and the 15th with the Australians in the north - did not fare well at all."

IIRC the War ended before or shortly after the Canadian Tank Corps finished training, so it wouldn't have been at Amiens.

That's all I have at the mo. I'll try to dig up some more.

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James H


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A bit more:

The Canadians were supported by IV Tank Brigade, comprising 1, 4, 5, & 14 Bn.

1 Bn was equipped with the V*, the remainder with V.

Acc to Charles Messenger, the Canadian Corps included:

1st Canadian Motor Machine Gun Brigade - 3 motor machine gun batteries, one machine gun company;

2nd Canadian Motor Machine Gun Brigade - 2 motor machine gun batteries, one machine gun company;

"this scheme to transport foot-soldiers in tanks did not work out well.
Jolted about in their cramped quarters, the men suffered severely from the
unaccustomed heat and fumes from the engines; many became sick, and a
number fainted. More than half of the infantry detachments were obliged to seek
fresh air and follow on foot. But there was worse to be faced than a lack of fresh
air. A single German battery hidden a thousand yards south of Beaucourt Wood
knocked out ten tanks. Eleven machines reached the objective; but because of
unexpectedly strong German fire coming from north and east of Le Quesnel,
seven of these picked up their infantry again and withdrew with them some 1500
yards"

Does this make sense?


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James H


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There's an account here that might be useful. From p164 onwards:

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=2_Gy6SoTYsQC&pg=PA161&dq=amiens+1918&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=4#v=onepage&q=amiens%201918&f=false

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charlieh


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Hi James,

It makes sense.   Some tanks would be used to support the infantry, some used to carry infantry, and others to carry the mg crews.

 

I dug back into my copies of the REPORT OF OPERATIONS, 4th Battalion CMGC , 7-16 August 1918 and found that the crews joined the 1st Battalion, Tank Corps for the attack.  Your response would indicate that the tanks were of the British Tank Corps.

 

Thanks also for the book link--very interesting reading!  It also confirms 1st Tank Battalion carried the crews.

 

Charlie



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