Landships II

TinCanTadpole · Legend

FT turrets

James H · Legend

The first (production) turret was the cast one on the example at Bov, which slopes sharply and was designed to carry only the Hotchkiss m.g. Next was the round, cast 'omnibus' version that could house either the m.g. or the 37mm gun. That was followed by the polygonal, and then the second round version.

Bov's FT is a training model, not the prototype, one of several loaned by the French. It's 'non prot�g�' (i.e. not armoured). There are quite a few differences between the prototype and the production model - louvres at the rear, one-piece cupola, etc.

Not sure what you mean by "cast hull parts." Can you elaborate?

BTW, Steve Zaloga's book on the FT can be read online here. It's been overtaken by events, somewhat, but generally pretty good.

My advice, if I might offer it, is to check anything you see on Wikipedia with Landships, where people tend to know what they're talking about in these matters.

TinCanTadpole · Legend

I'm having to reply a second time, as the broadband where I am is variable and decided to play up when I clicked the 'post reply' button. Grrr.

Okay, you say that there were four turrets, not three - and that the polygonal turret is not the 'omnibus' turret? I didn't know that; nor I fancy, do some kit manufacturers, who I think refer to the polygonal turret as 'omnibus'.

Cast hull parts. Are you asking what I want to know about them, or asking which parts I mean? I'm referring to the cast nose section and the upright that the driver's vision flap is set into; normally these parts are built up from plates, just like the rest of the hull, but Bov's FT has a couple of one-piece castings doing the jobs of various plates at these points.
If it was my question you wanted to know, well, I think I read a while ago that these cast pieces were introduced later on in production, so I wanted to verify this thought. The fact that the turret is of the first pattern would appear to nullify this question.

Finally, your advice is most welcome - I ask my questions here precisely because I've observed that people here on Landships are knowledgeable and that many a friendly and useful reply has been given. That said, although I am wary of Wikipedia's veracity, my experience of it suggests it receives greater criticism than it deserves - a view you may disagree with...("It was once thought...")

Thanks for the link James, I'll take a look when I have a moment spare.

James H · Legend

Sorry. The first model turret was for Hotchkiss only, as here. All the rest were 'omnibus,' i.e. able to take m.g. or 37mm, whether round or polygonal.

Can't tell you about the cast hull parts off the top of my head. Will try to find out more.

Wikipedia: Don't get me started.

TinCanTadpole · Legend

I see. The diagram I've seen before, in a thin paperback from a Purnell series (I think) circa 1973; that series also had a book on WW1 tanks and infantry weapons, but I haven't read it.

My questions also asked about the idler wheels on Bov's FT specimen; it's occurred to me that early examples may have had the insides of the idlers filled in, but it may have been found unnecessary or wasteful of materiel, thus deleted later on.

Pzkpfw-e · Commander in Chief

Bov's example is currently under restoration.

Renault FT-17 prototype by Massimo Foti, on Flickr
Looking at the surviving examples, http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_FT-17.pdf , the nose "cone" of Bov's example, does appear to be cast, the others have a 4-piece bolted nose.
Its and one turret preserved at Fort Seclin, are the only known survivors of the early, cast version.
http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_French_Tank_Turrets.pdf

TinCanTadpole · Legend

Thanks Charlie, that's useful to know.

Have just been looking through older threads and found a pic of a US instruction FT with early cast turret and cast vision flap housing (for want of a proper term). Can't see the 'nosecone', but can probably assume the combo of cast hull parts and turret was indeed a training tank thing.

The number, if it's of interest, is 66040, found at:

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http://landships.activeboard.com/t31289194/first-american-tanks/

-- Edited by TinCanTadpole on Monday 6th of February 2012 01:41:47 AM

THE OLD LANCER · Colonel

It's possible that the FT at Bov'y is made up of more than one tank, as I can not find any paperwork or photo's that have this make up!.
Can find one's with the front and one with the drivers part and a different turret but not altogether, as there were 3 types of turret made
for the prototypes + first porduction models it could have been made up as a training tank only??????

THE OLD LANCER

BC312 · Colonel

The Bovington FT track unit was removed and dismantled so it could be copied to restore another FT, just wondering if there was another FT in the UK somewhere. Anyone know or know of other FTs in the UK?

CharlieC · Legend

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There was a question on the idler wheels on the FT.

The early production FTs had an idler with wooden blocks spanning between the rim and hub. You can clearly see the blocks in the Flikr images of the Bovington FT.

After WW1 the original idlers were replaced by a steel casting of the same diameter. This has radial strenghtening ribs on the inside of the idler. The profile of the steel idler isn't same as the original idler - it's much flatter.

Regards,

Charlie