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Post Info TOPIC: Tanks Circa 1917/Early 1918


Brigadier

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Tanks Circa 1917/Early 1918
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I have Schnuck on the back burner, but I do have an interest in depicting any landship from the time period mentioned above.  There are the British tanks of course, but I was wondering about the French ones.

 

Trouble is, the Schneider kits I heard of are inaccurate, and the Takom kits are better.  But the early St, Chamond is actually an upgraded version with newer tanks, and I'm unsure when the later one came out, and what specific time period the later version is supposed to represent.

 

Reason?  I want to depict the period when The Red Baron was still around fighting (he was killed in April 1918).



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Captain

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Hello

Period 1917-1918 : The 2 models of Schneider tanks from Hobby boss are accurate ( where did you saw that they are wrong ? Only the box art is wrong ) . The model without the petrol tanks at the back are for April 1917 . first French chars attack . Then chars were modified , petrol tanks were relocated at the back . Only inaccuracy is the device to store the towing cable on the rear right is missing .

The Takom tanks you are referring are Saint Chamond. The model with flat roof is "Model 1 " but can be seen up to end of the war . The inaccuracy is  that it is fitted with the " large tracks " witch is impossible ( Be ready to cut  the track links ...). Also , the triangular piece D 32 should not be placed for early tanks ( This upgrade came latter , OK for a 1918 M1 ).The crew man in the kit have a splash mask , only supplied to French crew in summer 1918.

The Model 2 with inclined roof do not show any issues.

Hobby Boss is also making a M1 saint Chamond.

There is more and more kits of French crew on the market

Also you can get some upgraded resin kits for both Saint Chamond and Schneider.

Anything about French chars d assaut :

http://pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pages1418/Pages-d-Histoire-Artillerie/Artillerie-Speciale-chars-d-assaut/liste_sujet-1.htm

It is in French but lot of pictures , schematics, listings...very handy

Hope that's help

Best regards

Olivier



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Captain

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saint chamond second model.pngsaint chamond late.png

Hello
Hobby Boss is also producing Model 2 Saint Chamond ( With variants )
Both are with external re enforcement of armor. That was not always the case.
Have a look on the website , related to M2/M3 with variants of armor and guns :
http://pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pages1418/Pages-d-Histoire-Artillerie/Artillerie-Speciale-chars-d-assaut/artillerie-evolution-fabrications-sujet_1533_1.htm

Hopes that helps

Olivier



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Brigadier

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http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sealed-Box-1-35-Hobby-Boss-Schneider-CA-WW-I-Tank-/262567462365?hash=item3d223d85dd:g:pXsAAOSwIgNXnkXa

Thanks!  If this kit is good I'll buy it!  I'm not sure what the 1917 colors would be.

Yes, everyone thinks of British rhomboid tanks as the symbol of World War One, but I read that France, even if they didn't invent the tank, they produced the greatest number of them.



-- Edited by Long Tom on Sunday 14th of August 2016 04:13:39 AM

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Captain

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Hello
The one showed on your link is the first model of Schneider ( No petrol tanks at the rear , no escape door on the left )
It is suitable for attack of chemin des Dames April 1917
The box art is wrong , the decals in the box are wrong but the kit is OK
At that time the french tankers had no splash masks , no cut out helmets
For the colors .....the base was grey , after.....nobody will blame you on the brown or the green used
Best Regards
Olivier

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Field Marshal

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Bonjour,

 

On "Pages 14-18" topics, St Chamond M2 and M3 was only used to make difference between :

                       Saint Chamond with sloping roof and without pilot cupola

                      Saint Chamond with sloping roof and pilot cupola.

"M3" was just a "comfort label" .

On photos, there is some time, for the same Saint chamond (with sloping roof ) :

                   - Photos done at Cercottes, without the pilot cupola and in factory camouflage,

                   - Photos done at Cercottes or Champlieu, withthe pilot cupola and always in factory camouflage,

                   - Other photos done with the pilot cupola and in modified camouflage done by the team.

There is only M1 (with flat roof) and M2 (with sloping roof) and early and later model (used in english) is, at last, better !

French military documents never speak of model one or model two, and the two models were used together in the same units and in all fights from 1918.

The first Saint Chamond (with sloping roof and without cupola) arrived in Champlieu in April 1917. It was 8 Saint Chamond "caisson" (recovery without gun).

These tanks were refused by General Estienne, and sent back in the factory, and all Saint Chamond (with sloping roof and without cupola) built were stopped in Cercottes and Champlieu.

 

The Saint chamond(with sloping roof) was never used in fight, without cuppola.

All the factory exit Saint Chamond (without cupola) were equiped , in tank units, with there pilot cupola (in Cercottes or in Champlieu).

It was the tank numbers 62611 to 62679.

 

 

About the last Saint Chamond model from Hobby boss (with sloping roof and without cupola).

All the Saint Chamond (with 75 mm model 1897 and vertical backing band on the armor) are all exit from factory with their cupola.

It was the tank numbers 62680 to 62800.

 

The camouflage of Hobby boss (with some straight line) is interesting and was really used on some last built Saint Chamond.

Bon week-end - Michel

 

PS : For " the men who invented the tank" see : French Captain Levavasseur (1903)



-- Edited by Tanker on Sunday 14th of August 2016 09:23:42 AM

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Brigadier

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schneider_CA1#/media/File:Schneider-CA-1.Saumur.0004es9x.jpg

One last question-was this then a proper paint scheme?  I heard the one on the museum St. Chamond was all wrong.



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Colonel

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Why can't we get these kits done in 1/72nd or 1/76th scales?

Grant

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Brigadier

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Granty101 wrote:

Why can't we get these kits done in 1/72nd or 1/76th scales?

Grant


 Good question.  Of course the real advantage of the tiny scales is that you can do larger battle scenes.



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Captain

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cote gauche.JPGcote droit.JPGinterieur.jpgHello
Related to color scheme of chars , that was depending of lot of things.......rather have a look at the picture to have an idea.
I give you an example. This is a Schneider of AS 9 , 16 April 1917. Just green paint had been applied to the grey base. Now , other chars were with 3 tones schemes , sometimes outlined by a dark line ( Brown ? Black ? ).I think AS 9 was in the rush on painting their chars.
I opened the model ( Cut of the armor ) to have a look inside .( I made the inside with the crew members )
Please note the towing cable holder on the right aft side. Often forgotten .
The lower part of the char can be upgraded with a resin kit.
Also note : If you place a char in fighting situation , please remove all the equipment stored on the roof ( Tarpaulins , backpacks , cooking equipment...). Just the minimum was brought to the fight.( Jack / support for machine gun , timber , cable, a few drums ).
Best regards
Olivier



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Captain

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Hello

Related to the various paint schemes , have a look on the articles from Tanker ( Michel ) on the site :
pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pages1418/Pages-d-Histoire-Artillerie/Artillerie-Speciale-chars-d-assaut/liste_sujet-1.htm
Also to see nice pictures of Schneiders :
www.chars-francais.net/2015/index.php/classement-individuel/schneider-ca1
You can see the variants ! You have also the listing of serial numbers and nicknames of chars .
Please note that the suit of cards placement was not always the same from an AS to another .
I hope you speak French.....good readings !


Best Regards
Olivier

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Brigadier

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Well, the Hobby Boss kit just arrived; need to get it ready.

 

Only several hatches open, and the rear doors, but I'm not necessarily planning to show the tank in the midst of battle-before or after, or on the way to, is fine for my purpose.



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