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Post Info TOPIC: Albert Kahn Autochromes


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Albert Kahn Autochromes
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It may well be that these original Albert Kahn Autochrome photos have already been posted here. For me there are some unknown photos, so I thought I will post them nevertheless. And perhaps it sheds some new light on the camouflage question…

An interesting aspect (for me) is the widespread use of black in the dapple camo oft he guns!

 

Alber Kahn Autochrome Chuignes 1929 [1].jpg  Alber Kahn Autochrome Paris 1918 [1].jpg

Alber Kahn Autochrome Paris 1918 [2].jpg  Alber Kahn Autochrome Place de la Concorde 1918 [1].jpg

Bigger resolutions and Some interesting shots of the Beutetanks can be found here: https://collections.albert-kahn.hauts-de-seine.fr/simple-recherche?q=



-- Edited by Peter T on Thursday 13th of April 2023 08:00:05 PM

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Well, that is weird. I was thinking about Albert Kahn only this morning. Hew Strachan's First World War is being repeated on some satellite channel, and it features a lot of Kahn's autochromes in the opening credits. I was going to google him. I'll do that now.



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I thought I could write down some words concerning what I can deduce from these Autographs.

Photo No. 1 and 2

1.jpg

2.jpg

The Dapple scheme consists of the basic Feldgrau overpainted with spots of two colours: brown (RAL 8003 Lehmbraun, RAL 8025 Blassbraun or even RAL 8027 Lederbraun), darker than the ground colour, and sand (RAL 1000 Grünbeige or RAL 1002 Sandgelb), brighter than the ground colour. Additionally there are distinctives spots of white and black.

 

Photo No. 3

3.jpg

In this scheme the basic Feldgrau is rather a pale green (Hugo Lander also mentions RAL 6011 or 6025), overpainted (sponged?) with crude spots of sand, white and black. A brown hue cannot be determined here….

 

Photo No. 4

With this photo we are facing a very difficult task because the colors have already faded a lot. What I can make out, that the blotches have been painted on in a more elaborate way. The «artist» draw more complicated shapes, almost interlocking. In this way the basic Feldgrau seems to meander through the camo colors. And we find also spots of brown, white and black. On this gun a sand hue cannot be determined clearly.

     4.jpg

 

Conclusion

I believe that this pictures are an idication that Dapple Camo consisted of a basic Feldgrau roughly overpainted with blotches of brown, sand, white and black (all or some of them). Black and white can be found on all of those guns!

Please note:

I deliberately took the article on the Landships II as basis for some additional interpretations. And I choose the RAL colour code for easier comparison with Udo Lander’s research* on the color « Feldgrau ».

 

*Udo Lander: Anstrich und Kennzeichnung der Sturmpanzerwagen A7V



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If I can make the observation that back in WW1 and before paints were defined by recipes of pigments rather than reference to standard colour samples.

There seem to have been large variations in shades which nominally were the same colour. The British Colour Council (BCC) was created in 1930 and, I believe, the

first RAL series colours were created about the same time. 

Hundleby and Strasheim hypothesise in their book on the A7V tank that the colours painted over the base Feldgrau the tanks were delivered in was

Belgian railway paint acquired when the German organisation B.A.K.P 20 took over the railway workshops. Considering the poor state of German industrial

resources in 1918 perhaps the paint used for the overpainted blotches on the artillery pieces was whatever the troops could find. The green, brown and sand colours could easily have been French vert olive (olive green) , terre d'ombre (brown) and ocre jaune (yellow ochre) paint. 

Charlie

 



-- Edited by CharlieC on Saturday 15th of April 2023 11:23:48 AM

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CharlieC wrote:

If I can make the observation that back in WW1 and before paints were defined by recipes of pigments rather than reference to standard colour samples.

There seem to have been large variations in shades which nominally were the same colour. The British Colour Council (BCC) was created in 1930 and, I believe, the

first RAL series colours were created about the same time. 

-- Edited by CharlieC on Saturday 15th of April 2023 11:23:48 AM

 

Hi Charlie

Thanks a lot for your thoughts. And you are absolutely right! Alas, after having written some lines in an English-speaking forum (I live in the German-speaking part of Switzerland) I often get the feeling that I can’t really express what I really wants to say.

So I am well aware that colors back in those times were far away from standard colours. Udo Lander was one of the first in the German-speaking region to do some serious research on the camo colors in relation to the German Army. He examined German equipment in its original color and describes the color hues based on the RAL color card. The RAL code is well known in my area, so I used this color system to describe what I believe to see on the photos no matter whether these colors are faded, of French origin or Belgian railway paint. Concerning the variations in shade, Udo Lander discovered more then nine color hues alone for the so called « Feldgrau » (And so it always makes me smile when I read endless discussions for example about the exact hue of German Panzergelb of WW2).

As I wrote bevore I deliberately took the article on the Landships II as basis for my additions as to update it with some marginal differences. And the « Buntfarbenanstrich » is a story in itself as well as the B.A.K.P. 20 and the Belgian railway paint...

Moritz.jpg

 

All the best from the other side of the earth 😉

 



-- Edited by Peter T on Saturday 15th of April 2023 03:58:30 PM



-- Edited by Peter T on Saturday 15th of April 2023 03:59:20 PM

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