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Post Info TOPIC: Smaller wars you might have missed
Centurion


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Smaller wars you might have missed
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Gentlemen,


I promised I would try and develop some accounts of the contingent conflicts on the 1914-18 main event. Ive done a first pass on the Estonian war(s). As its a bit long for a posting I've attached it as a PDF. I'll do more but only if any one is interesed. let me know.



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Tim R


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Alway's interested Robert, I am a very big collector of Estonian military hardware, pictures and books, They built some very interesting Armoured Cars as well.


Keep up the great work


"Idea" How about some information on the Finish Civil War.


All the Best


Tim R


Here is a few Pictures:



-- Edited by Tim R at 03:03, 2006-01-17

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pisuhand.jpg (81.1 kb)
vanapagan.jpg (91.0 kb)
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eugene


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Robert, that was some great stuff, keep it comming its very informative


maybe Peter will post this on his site?


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Centurion


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has anyone had trouble downloading the PDF file ? If so please let me know. Ive tried opening it myself and it no longer opens.

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eugene


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works fine for me


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Centurion


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Tim,


Thanks for the photos - one of them shows another view of the home made armour I reffered to - very like a Spanish Civil War Armoured Bus


Finland is on the list but I'm strugling with Latvia at the moment.



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Paul Bonnett


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No Problems with file, Thanks for posting.


  Paul



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Peter Kempf


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Interesting stuff! If you send me the file in, say, Word format, I could post it on the site.


All the best



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Michel Boer


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Well, for those who are interested in Estonian armour, I can recommend the book "Eesti Soomusmasinad" by Tiit Noormets and Mati Oun, isbn 9985-60-692-2. It contains loads of photo's of Estonian armour from 1918 upto 1940, and lots of info (in Estonian....)

And for those who would like to make a model of an Estonian, Latvian or Lithuanian vehicle, I can reveal that I've designed a decal sheet for these countries (including decals for a LK-II in Swedish service), which will be marketed soon under the Landships flag. (Sorry Peter, I couldn't keep it a secret... )

Here's another photo of the Vanapagan armoured car and photo's of the Austin Putilov (which changed camo scheme regularly!) and Renault FT 17 (one of their own, and not one of those loaned by the Finns to Yudenich).

All the best,
Michel Boer.



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vanapagan.jpg (69.1 kb)
EST aust-put.jpg (287.6 kb)
EST FT17.jpg (271.2 kb)
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eugene


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I cant load the last 2 photos, the book sounds interesting where can you get it?


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Centurion


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Peter I enclose Estonia and Latvia both in Word

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Tim R


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Hello Michel


I would be most interested in your decal sheet; I look forward to them.


I am glade you recommended "Eesti Soomusmasinad" by Tiit Noormets and Mati Oun,


It is a very good book, I also highly recommend it. I found my copy on eBay, of course I don’t speak or read Estonian, but I have a common interest in what the book is written about, so I found some one at the local collage “University of Alabama” in the speech department to translate it for me. Very interesting.


I have been planning an article on the Estonian Vehicles, But I was unsure if any one would be interested, I guess they are!!!!!


All the Best


Tim R.


 



-- Edited by Tim R at 23:28, 2006-01-17

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Tim R


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If any one is interested in Estonian. Latvian or Lithuanian Armoured Vehicles, let me know, I have at least 50 different photos of these respected countries vehicles.Armoured Cars,Tanks,AAGun Trucks, Armoured Trains, etc...,


All the Best


Tim R



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Michel Boer


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Tim,

Even though I've got quite some photo's on the subject, I would much appreciate it if you could send me all you've got on the armored vehicles.

For those who like it, I've attached a (color!) photo of a Latvian Vickers-Carden-Lloyd light tank during a parade in Riga on may 15, 1939. The Latvians upgunned the original vehicle (though not their entire inventory) with a long barrelled 40 mm gun. One such vehicle still remains in Kubinka; when I visited Kubinka in '94, the tank was still in British colors...

all the best,
Michel Boer



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Tim R


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Michel


  I will gather them up this weekend and send them over, by the way for some reason some of your photos do not show up?????? Is anybody else having this problem??


All the Best


Tim R



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Michel Boer


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Tim,

That would be great, thanks! I've attached those two photo's again; hope they can be opened now.

Michel.



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EST aust-put.jpg (141.2 kb)
EST FT17.jpg (133.4 kb)
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Michel Boer


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Nope, they don't....

I'll think of something....

Michel.

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GrzeM


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Thank you for the articles.

My great-grandpa fought in the Polish forces helping Latvia, but unfortunately I don't know many details except the fact that they were fed almost only with califlowers.

Armoured car on the photo in the Latvian text is the Garford "Laucplesis" mentioned in the text.

Cheers!
G.

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Michel Boer


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That's right; the model in the photo is actually on display in the Riga war museum, located in the Pulvertornis tower. Here's another shot.

All the best,
Michel.

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Centurion


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An even smaller war
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Continuing the series I enclose a very short account of a relatively minor conflict (although dedly serious if one got shot in it) - the Carinthian conflict.

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eugene


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RE: Smaller wars you might have missed
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thanks for another interesting conflict!
does any one have photos from the Carinthian conflict?


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Centurion


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Therre are some good photos of som of the aircraft used in Issue 1 of Insignia  Nov 1995 published by Blue Rider - I'm not going to scan any though, as I've met some of the Blue Rider guys who are the sort who send the lawyers round if their magazine passes within five miles of a photocopier.

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Centurion


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And now Lithuania. Most wars have two sides. The Lithuanians managed to get into a three sided war!

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Centurion


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And another - Silesia 1919 -1922 (where ? I hear you cry). Please let me know if any of this is of any interest as there are many more WWI subsiduary wars to go (do I hear groans?) but I'll stop on request.


 



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Centurion


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I enclose details of the war with Turkey and Kurdish insurgents 1918 - 1924. I've separated this from the various other insurrections in Iraq at the time because it was really a different conflict and also because it involved two of the original 1914/18 combatants Britain and Turkey. Indeed because  Turkey failed to ratify the peace treaty that was meant to end Turkeys involvement in WWI one could argue that these can be  legitimally described as the last actions of the First World War.


It teaches that in the Middle East (and especially in Iraq) the old adage that "my enemy's enemy is my friend" does not hold true - he can still be your enemy as well


Gentlemen I'm getting no feed back as to wether you feel this items worthwhile so if you want any more let me know or else this will be the last



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Tim R


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Hello Robert


As far as I am concerned, Please keep on going. I am a model builder, but I am also a Historian on this period, so I read and collect a lot about odd little Wars etc., from this period of time.


Thanks Tim


 



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Keep it coming! I enjoy these pieces, and when you are comnpletely done I want to post it on the site!

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Michel Boer


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Robert,

By all means, do go on. I've seen plenty of books on the trench war in France, but hardly anything on these smaller wars and 'spin-off' wars. As it looks, some of these smaller wars have had much bigger political consequences than most people realise.

My special interest in these wars is the armor that was used; not just the regular mass produced stuff, but also the improvised vehicles. I've attached some pictures of the 'Korfanty' A/C; an improvised armoured car built in 1921, named after the Polish 'warlord' Korfanty who played such a significant role in the Silesian conflict.

all the best,
Michel.



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korfanty 2.jpg (12.2 kb)
korfanty 3.jpg (22.8 kb)
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Tim R


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Those are awesome Michel, Do you have any more odd Armoured Car photos.
All The Best
Tim R.

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Tim R


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Hey Guys
Here is a little bigger and clearer photo of "Korfanty" Polish Armoured Car.
All the Best

Tim R

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Centurion


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I enclose one of the smallest wars (but one with some major consequences) - the tradgi comedy of Fiume

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Tim R


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Robert
Very interesting, I have not read very much about this conflict.
Thanks
All the Best
Tim R


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Centurion


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Fiume update


 


Since my last posting (just after - isn't always the way) I've discovered some inaccuracies.


Basically the Arditi's black shirts look like being another of piece of D'Annunzio's propaganda - photographs show them wearing Italian army uniforms - some of which look like alpini. possibly one of two may have posed in them but it wasn't the norm


They had armoured cars and not improvised ones either. They didn't march on Fiume (as D'Annunzio used to put about) they drove. One has to suspect the complicity of the Italian army if not the government itself.


 



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Michel Boer


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Tim R wrote:

Those are awesome Michel, Do you have any more odd Armoured Car photos. All The Best Tim R.


Tim,
I'll scan some more these days.

all the best,
Michel.



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Centurion


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Here's another one Hungary, Rumania and Czechoslovakia this time

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Michel Boer


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The story of Hungary helps to understand the sequel in WW2; in the prelude to that, Hungary re-occupied Transsylvania and was thus brought into the Axis forces.
In the closing months of the war, Rumania switched sides. Although tired of war and short of weaponry, the Rumanians were forced by the Red Army to fight the Germans. When they met however the Hungarian army on the battlefield, they eagerly entered the fight....
After that, in 1989, it was the Hungarian minority in Transsylvania who more or less started the Rumanian revolution, demanding civil rights and recognitian as a minority.
There you see that these things can linger on for many years.....

Michel.

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Centurion


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Another very small war with longer term ramifications - The Czechoslovakian Polish War 1919. Actually many accounts are contradictory (partly because the Czechs still blame the Poles and vice versa) so any one who can shed firther light is welcome.

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Michel Boer


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Tim R wrote:

Those are awesome Michel, Do you have any more odd Armoured Car photos. All The Best Tim R.
Tim,
Here's one familiar car, but with a rare marking on it. It's Lithuanian.

All the best,
Michel.

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Centurion


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A rather bigger one - the Greco Turkish war 1919 -1922. However whilst there should be lots of detail on numbers, units, equipment  artillery etc etc I can find none. Producing this series I think I can see light at the end of the tunnel (probably a man with a flammenwerfer!) and when they are finished I'd like to go over them all and update ammend etc. So please can anybody who has any extra data on any of these conflicts please send it on.


 



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Centurion


Legend

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RE: Smaller wars you might have missed
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I enclose a paper describing some of the ephemeral states that came into existance as a result of WWI and its aftermath - note this is part one only. Some of the details available on some of the others is so self contradictary and confused its wet towel round the head time to unravel them but I will get round to it.

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