Landships II

airdave · Major

RE: WW1 Canadian Armoured Autocar

airdave · Major

phew! lol I thought I was going to have to redesign those parts!

thats great...I appreciate the feedback!

working on the front hubs and steering parts...I can see the long tie rod connection across the front,
but I can't see how the steering box/linkage attaches to the wheel(s).
do you have any photos that show the linkage and attachment at the spindles?

Great War Truck · Brigadier

I double checked and you got it right from the drawings. The coupling i showed is the connection between the engine and water pump. Sorry. The main propshaft was made by spicer and is a Hooke's joint type of coupling hidden inside a thin streel casing and packed with grease and it looks very much like what you have already produced.

airdave · Major

thanks again Tim!

Obviously this is not the Drive/Prop Shaft from the Gearbox to the rear End.
But you are saying these are the same couplings as on your driveshaft?
It looks like a flexible ring between the joiner ends?

As you can see in the following photo, I did a preliminary mockup of the parts a few days ago, working from the Blueprint Diagrams of the Autocar Armored Car.
But my coupling joints are nothing like what you are showing me.

(My Prop Shaft is a little small in this pic...it has since been enlarged in diameter)

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I am basing the design on this Blueprint Diagram...not the clearest diagram I agree,

but you can clearly see (in this closeup) the Bell Housed couplings on the drive Shaft.

Either these are Bell covers over similar couplings (as you have shown) or they are Bell housed Constant velocity style joints.

Is this a much different vehicle than yours then?

-- Edited by airdave on Monday 21st of November 2011 06:06:34 AM

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Strangely, i dont have any photos of the shaft. However, this is a photo from the Autocar tipper with a shaft running from the gearbox to the tipper crank. The shaft set up and couplings are much the same, only the prop shaft would be longer. I hope this helps a little bit.
Tim

Great War Truck · Brigadier

airdave wrote:
Tim...got any photos of Prop shaft and couplings?
Can't see in any of the photos if there are Universal joints or what.
I'm guessing they're CV style joints?
�i dont have any photos of the one in this Autocar, but i think i have some of the other Autocar. Give me a few days and i will see what i can find.
Tim

CharlieC · Legend

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It reminds me a lot of the British Jowett flat twin engine used in the 1950s Bradford van.

Regards,

Charlie

-- Edited by CharlieC on Thursday 17th of November 2011 12:48:06 AM

LincolnTanker · Commander in Chief

Thanks Airdave for that video, it sounds more refined than�the 2CV I had.

I'm impressed with your chassis! the wheel looks good as well.

airdave · Major

Tim...got any photos of Prop shaft and couplings?
Can't see in any of the photos if there are Universal joints or what.

I'm guessing they're CV style joints?

�

....

�

Lincoln Tanker...Autocar engine running:

-- Edited by airdave on Thursday 17th of November 2011 12:13:12 AM

LincolnTanker · Commander in Chief

Thanks Tim for the longer video, the local birds can be heard over the sound of the engine.�There seems to be more machanical sound than exhaust or is that the soundtrack?

airdave · Major

forgot to post this latest update on the design...

Started on the drivetrain components.

More info here

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Sorry. There is no specified colour as such. Ours is matched against some original paint. To give an exact definition of its actual shade well it looks like really fresh cow crap. i dont think there is a right or wrong, although if you get it really wrong then it will look really really wrong.

Tim

airdave · Major

Tim, I have a question about the colour?

I am suggesting that the paint colour of your frame (and probably the entire vehicle)
is very close to the same colour of the Armored Car in Ottawa Canada.
Based on all the photos I have.
...do you agree?

So, would you have a Paint code? or some reference I could use for my model.

Currently I am using a greyish greeny browny kinda colour...Hex code (html) #73705F RGB R115 G112 B95
It tends to go grey, almost bluish, in flash photos.
Its difficult to get a good feel in my photos, but it was sampled from a section of frame (in a photo).

I'd like to track down an actual paint colour used and adjust my model colour if necessary.

-- Edited by airdave on Wednesday 16th of November 2011 12:48:44 AM

Great War Truck · Brigadier

I have just uploaded a longer clip of the WD Autocar here if it is of any help:

If you click on the picture it should play.

This one is a genuine WW1 army lorry and is we beleive the sole survivor of the approx 600 purchased by the War Department.

-- Edited by Great War Truck on Tuesday 15th of November 2011 11:37:06 PM

airdave · Major

Full report HERE

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Finally got a basic Wheel design sorted out.

Les Fowler · Sergeant

Sounds like it would scare the crap out of the Krauts too once they knew it was the Canadian Motor Machine Gunners coming.

Great War Truck · Brigadier

LincolnTanker wrote:
Cricky, that's one big flat twin! does it sound like a 2CV on steroids?

Sorry, i didnt answer your question. it runs a lot slower than the Citroen and sounds more like something heavy�sliding down a flight of stairs. For some reason horses cant stand the sound and totally freak out.

Hopefully, this clip of film (if it works) will give you an insite in to how they sound (on a windy day). if you click on it it should play.

�

airdave · Major

Chassis and Spring Assembly...installation of Axles

Latest progress posted here at Papermodelers.com

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Great War Truck · Brigadier

Fantastic progress. here are some photos of the wheels. Do remember that the armoured cars had solid tyres, the GS wagons pneumatic tyres and the water tankers had pneumatics on the front and solids on the back. Front and rear wheels had different numbers of spokes as well.

airdave · Major

Works continues� FULL UPDATE HERE

only got front springs finished last night

still got some adjustments to make to the rea spring parts

-- Edited by airdave on Thursday 10th of November 2011 03:49:05 PM

airdave · Major

haha...yes I did ask this...and then I continued to post...I guess I forgot about my question! lol sorry

thank you, I will stay here!

Les Fowler · Sergeant

airdave said.....Since this is not originally my thread, should i continue to hijack? (lol) or should I start a new thread for this project?
Stay with this thread ' I don't mind at all.

airdave · Major

Thanks Tim!! for these wonderful photos.
Just a great opportunity for all to see how this little vehicle went together.

As you may have noticed, there are many areas of the model that are simplified.
Altered to suit a card model design, rather than being technically accurate.
Theres also a lot of details that will be eliminated because of the difficulties of working
at this scale and in paper.
(An obvious example is cables, small linkages, lines and hoses.)

So, although I appreciate the multiple angles you are providing in the many photos,
I hope you understand why I may ignore some elements. Especially when it comes to
designing a paper Motor.

Having said that, I will admit I am saving every photo you post and I appreciate all
the effort in providing them!

If I may ask...I would love to see the back sides of the wheels...Brake Drums and Hub attachments.

I am going to start working on a Wheel and Tire design very soon.
And that means I need to figure out the mounting and attachments to the front and rear axles.

Right now, I will finish up the Leaf Spring assemblies and attempt to get the Axles mounted
to the Frame...

airdave · Major

Diff-Rear Axle figured out.

Full Info here

�

LincolnTanker · Commander in Chief

Cricky, that's one big flat twin! does it sound like a 2CV on steroids?

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Final batch of engine shots:

I am intrigued to see how you get on with the engine.

Tim

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Here are some engine shots. I hope you can make sense of them:

Great War Truck · Brigadier

if you are having trouble with the springs, then these two might help. or they might make it more confusing:

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Thats excellent. Do by all means carry on posting here. Right, i better warm up the scanner then.

airdave · Major

with all the Frame Rails in place, I am now tackling many of the attachments.
But first I need to sort out the leaf Springs to attach the front Axle
(and then the Rears to attach the Diff Housing)

My original ideas for a paper leaf Spring assembly didn't work too well
and I had to rethink it.
In the end I built an actual Leaf Spring with individual paper leaves.
It turned out great...and turned out to be quite easy to assemble!

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In my finished Kit, I will include a "jig" as shown, to help you assemble the Spring and glue into its proper shape and curve.

This was just a test build...and requires only one minor modification.

I've got the attachment brackets designed too, so tonight I should be able put together a full set of front Springs.

Because of this design success, I have also laid out the pattern for the three rear Springs, but I still need to work out position and bracketry.

I have also mocked up a Differential/Axle Housing...so I will test build that tonight aswell.

-- Edited by airdave on Tuesday 8th of November 2011 10:06:57 PM

airdave · Major

Since Tim has come up with these great Chassis photos (and more to come)
I have been able to go back over my first Chassis design and start making some changes.
I have also added some new parts including the Engine support "sub-frame".

Rather than repost every detail of the design here, I can just direct you to my Design and Build thread
at Papermodelers.com.
The latest post here

�

Since this is not originally my thread, should i continue to hijack? (lol) or should I start a new thread for this project?

�

Great War Truck · Brigadier

OK. No problem. Give me a while and i will scan the next batch. The box is what the seat sits on. In that picture it is just resting on the back of the chassis prior to moving it to the front. I am fairly sure the Armoured Autocars would have had a different sort of seat box, but i have never seen one. if you do get a photo of the canadian one i would love to see it

airdave · Major

thanks for all these pics!
this is amazing.

I'm not sure how much more you intend to post but I'm thinking you might have supplied me with enough
to get started on the frame and suspension.

I'd love to see a few angles of the assembled motor (in and out of the chassis by chance?)

And then I'll be moving on to the decking/floor and cockpit area.
So, I would love to see pics of those.

what is the large box and the back end of the chassis?

Great War Truck · Brigadier

here are the last lot i have of the chassis. which bit do you want next?

Great War Truck · Brigadier

airdave · Major

I never would (wood) have imagined the wooden frame rails!
I will actually try to include that in my paper design!

Great War Truck · Brigadier

This Autocar has had a hard life. At some stage the chassis was broken into two and repaired. The chassis rails are made of "armoured hickory", which is basically a steel channel with a hunk of hickory pushed inside. In some photos you can see where the hickory has had to be replaced so it looks just like empty channel.
Tim

Great War Truck · Brigadier

yes, 800 would be too much for my poor scanner and the bandwidth no doubt. I have scanned the next lot smaller ( i think).

airdave · Major

I have begun saving!
thanks you

please don't get too carried away...I wouldn't expect 800 photos!

a general view from various angles of the chassis and its most important parts would probably suffice.
There are limits to how much detail I can recreate in paper.

But I must admit, some of those closeups will sure come in handy!
awesome

Great War Truck · Brigadier

Right. I have dug out the photos. I have about 800 in all. they are all pre digital age so i have to scan them and will do them in small batches as and when time allows. This lot are of the chassis as we took it apart. You should be able to match up the locations from the plans i scanned previously. Any questions, do let me know. Thanks. Tim